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Reputation:98
Level:Superstar
Since:Jan 21, 2007
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"Tex is better than Howard, point blank. Would you want a guy who bats under .200 with more strikeouts than hits come to the plate? Or a guy who will put the ball in play? If you choose Howard ur just being foolish"
call me a fool then!... i'd take Ryan over "Tex" any day. you realize Ryan's heating up right? while Tex is slumping... 5 runs, 6 hits, 1 HR, only 4 RBI's, and a .167 avg so far this month. lets hold off on raggin on Howard for another month or so... still 120 games left!
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Reputation:89
Level:All-Star
Since:Nov 22, 2006
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Heating up? By heating up..do you mean he's batting like .212 this month? If thats ur idea of "Heating up", i guess Delgado must be scorching the ball. Since he's batting .271 this month.
Howard is better than he's batting, but he's not as great as most of you think he is. If he were on another team, you'd be calling him all sorts of bums who cant hit the ball. You just proved my point, by referring to how bad Tex's stats are for half the month. Well guess what..thats very similiar to Howard's stats for the MONTH of April.
Howard is better than his average and stats show, but he's not someone you should expect to bat close to .300 or better. Like someone said earlier.. you cant make a productive out, by striking out.
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Reputation:98
Level:Superstar
Since:Jan 21, 2007
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well i agree he will not come close to hitting .300 this year. Still i'd take his numbers over Tex... any day. Runs, RBI, HR', and it will be very close in the end with On Base Percentage. you can have the .270-.280 avg from Mark and the 70 less K's.
heating up i mean... 7 game hit streak. compared to Mark getting nothing last 3 games.
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Reputation:92
Level:All-Star
Since:Dec 12, 2007
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Howard's having a slow star, but he'll heat up and still hit close to 50 home runs with 120 + RBI. Will he hit close to 0.300? No, but I'll take OPS over batting average any day (and I'll take strikeouts over double plays any day, too).
Here are the OPS's from the past 3 seasons for 7 of the biggest hitters in the game (not necessarily THE biggest). Who would you take (as a hitter, defensive position aside)? Values multiplied by 1000:
1) 1001, 1049, 1066
2) 1039, 1102, 997
3) 1031, 915, 1067
4) 923, 1084, 976
5) 982, 1058, 881
6) 954, 885, 963
7) 981, 909, 781
1 - David Ortiz; 2 - Albert Pujols; 3 - ARod; 4 - Ryan Howard; 5 - Manny Ramirez; 6 - Mark Teixeira; 7 - Carlos Delgado
Based on these, there are 3 who I'd pretty clearly take over Howard (Ortiz, Pujols, and ARod) and 3 who I pretty clearly wouldn't (Ramirez, Teixeira, and Delgado). Factor in age and splits, and it would be a closer call between Howard and Teixeira. Factor in position, and it's pretty hands down ARod. Miguel Cabrera (946, 998, 966) and Vladimir Guerrero (959, 934, 950) would be close calls. This is how Howard stacks up.
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Reputation:89
Level:All-Star
Since:Nov 22, 2006
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The problem with the stats your putting up, is that all of the mentioned have at least 5yrs of service, and just Tex and Miggy are younger. No one knows if he hit his peak in '06, but its pretty much graved in stone that he wont be batting over .300 this year. Im assuming his OPS was .923 last year. Ok i can agree on you picking Howard over Delgado and maybe Tex, but Manny Ramirez? Are you kidding me? You can't expect me to believe that you seriously think Howard is a better hitter than Manny. Manny IS going into the Hall of Fame, and has more time in the Majors hitting successfully than Howard has post puberty.
But to answer your question, without a doubt you choose A-Rod, Pujols, Ortiz, Vladdy, Miggy and Ramirez. If anything You gotta give the bat to Tex because he'd still put the ball in play and he hits from both sides. Delgado is no longer the delgado from 3+ years ago, but Howard isnt the Howard from 2yrs ago and he's 28. Better yet in a 6x6 or 7x7 Roto league how would you rank those people.(Strikeouts being a factor)
You mention that you'd prefer a strikeout over a Double-Play. Well if Reyes hits into Double Plays, i know Howard is too. So not only is he capable of striking out, but he's capable of hitting into double plays too. Either way, when a player makes nearly 100 more outs by whiffing or getting a strike 3 called, he still isnt going to drive in a run. Where as a player, out of the 100 outs, can still make a productive out.
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Reputation:92
Level:All-Star
Since:Dec 12, 2007
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1) Wrong, 923 is from his ROY (short) season, 976 is from last year, in which he got a slow start. I'd be surprised if he isn't still over 900 this year.
2) Manny WAS better, but right now I'd take Howard any day. Personally, I couldn't give a crap if Howard ends up in the Hall (given that he's been the fastest to 100 homers, he just might if he keeps up this pace), Manny definitely should (we agree there), but right now I'd take Howard.
3) I would not take Guerrero over Howard. I've said it before, though, I would probably trade Howard for Cabrera straight up, but that's only because Cabrera can play positions that Howard can't and he's much younger.
4) I don't play roto, don't know anything about it, don't care.
5) Double play = 2 outs rally killer. Strike out = 1 out. Obviously, strikeouts don't drive in runs... so, yeah, I'm disappointed that Howard wastes those extra 100 at bats, otherwise he'd be driving in 180 runs insted of 140. Strikeouts don't bother me in the least unless there's nothing else to go along with it... Bill James and Billy Beane (2 people who actually understand the game) would agree with that. Oh, by the way, Howard has hit into a total of 29 double plays in 452 at bats, which is more than some players hit into in a season (granted, Reyes hits into fewer).
6) It's easy to attack a player when he's down... come back in October... you can berate Howard then while he's still playing and Delgado is golfing.
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Reputation:92
Level:All-Star
Since:Dec 12, 2007
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sorry, that'd be 452 GAMES.
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Reputation:99
Level:Superstar
Since:Jul 11, 2007
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Now there were tons of posts about Howard, why didn't you direct it to anyone of those people?
Because none of those people were making fun of Philly fans for past statements about Howard.. coming here and more or less saying "na na na na na na". And, by the way, if you had bothered to look at who was making the posts, you would have seen there were 3 different Braves fans on here talking about him, and even a White Sox fan for some odd reason. So it wasn't all Phillie fans saying things about him.. so your original jab doesn't even fly. And the only reason anyone even mentioned Tex was jokingly to the Braves fans who were here.
Did i bash him or any fans just now, nooooooo. I simply said, when i mentioned these things months ago, Philly fans basically proclaimed him a god.There's nothing simple about the way you put it. And, yes, you did bash the fans when you come here and say they were pretty much stupid months ago for praising Howard, and then come back when Howard is at his worst to try to prove your point.
Would you want a guy who bats under .200 with more strikeouts than hits come to the plate? Or a guy who will put the ball in play? If you choose Howard ur just being foolish.First of all, this is still MAY. Do you honestly think Howard is still gonna be hitting .180-something come September?? This is still way early in the season. Do you realize if Howard has just one 4-for-4 game, his average will jump up about 21 points. And if he were to go 10-for his next-20.. which is averaging a 2-for-4 game five games in a row, his avg. would jump up 36 points to be at .224. When averages can change that much in a short period of time, you know there's still plenty of time left to get it better.
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Reputation:99
Level:Superstar
Since:Jul 11, 2007
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Would you want a guy who bats under .200 with more strikeouts than hits come to the plate? Or a guy who will put the ball in play? Like I said before, Teixeira, for all of his "putting the ball in play" as you testify to, has that gotten him a ton of RBIs or better stats at all? No. Howard still has more of every power stat than Tex, so that's a pretty moot point. Even with 50+ points less on his average, he is getting better stats.
Face it, Howard is a glorified power hitter, who has a big tendency to strikeout. WOW.. really??? Stop the presses!!! Show me one person who didn't believe Howard was a power hitter who strikes out.. I'd like to meet him! And while you're at it, show me anyone who is considered a "power hitter" who doesn't have a tendency to strike out. By the way.. here comes a stat for you.. who has the best record in the major leagues right now? That would be the Arizona Diamondbacks.. do you realize they have the 3rd most strikeouts in the majors? About 30 more K's as a team than the Phils, with the Phils having an extra game played. Harp on Howard's K's all you want, but he's one man on the Phils.. the D-backs have 3 of the 9 guys (and 2 of the top 4) who strike out the most all on one team.. and yet it hasn't hurt them in having the best record. The Phils may have the top guy, but their next 2 guys are in the 28th and 98th spots on the list.
Howard is your clean-up hitter, he should be driving in more runs than Delgado who is batting 6th or 7th in the lineup. So how's your clean-up hitter doing? Beltran has the same RBIs as Howard, with 3 times less homers, and is hitting an amazing .246. Another guy with 50+ avg. points on Howard who can't beat his power stats. And he's your clean-up guy.
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Reputation:92
Level:All-Star
Since:Dec 12, 2007
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And while you're at it, show me anyone who is considered a "power hitter" who doesn't have a tendency to strike out.I'm not bashing on this because it's definitely true in general. I just saw something the other day along these lines that amazed me... I'd forgotten how little Frank Thomas (not the power hitter he once was, but still) strikes out. ... only ever broke 100 3 times and has almost 300 more career walks than Ks... amazing. Even more amazing, Joe DiMaggio hit 361 career homers and only struck out only 369 times! Of course, there's that Bonds guy, too.
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Reputation:89
Level:All-Star
Since:Nov 22, 2006
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WOW!! You know there are situations u protect ur players, but how could anyone look at what Manny has and CONTINUES to do, and say with a straight face..id take Howard. Hitting a ball 500 feet, doesnt mean squat if ur batting . 250 or less, or in his case .180+
You wouldnt get Cabrera on a straight up deal,lol. So thats a pipe dream. If ur putting Howard in the same category as these hitters, than u must think Utley is the best player in baseball. Because Utley is a better player, by far. He can hit for power, average, runs the bases well and drive in runs.
Double plays are a part of baseball. You get nothing productive from a strikeout. You make it seem as if someone makes the extra 100 outs by hitting into Double Plays. The reason he only hit into 29 double plays is because in 452 at-bats he spent 200+ at bats whiffing, and 120+ getting hits. The other at bats..guys are either not on base or could be anywhere. So of course he doesnt hit into many Double Plays. If managers thought like you on this topic...they'd be fired. Runners on base or in scoring positions. You try and put the ball in play... Hall of Famer's arent made up of guys whiffing at and watching strike 3, because they dont wanna hit into a DP.
Here's an example:
100 At bats and there all K's... 0 production
100 at bats and maybe 10-20 DP's, 10-20 are sacrifices to bring in runs, 1-3 errors in the field and 10 getting a runner over. The pluses out weigh the negatives.
If ur a coach, do u tell ur guy to strikeout or put the ball in play and hope for something good?
As for beating Howard while he's down..i didnt create this thread. I basically said ...... I told you so. Hell im beating down my own players(Except Church, Schneider, Alou).
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Reputation:89
Level:All-Star
Since:Nov 22, 2006
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Because none of those people were making fun of Philly fans for past statements about Howard.. coming here and more or less saying "na na na na na na". And, by the way, if you had bothered to look at who was making the posts, you would have seen there were 3 different Braves fans on here talking about him, and even a White Sox fan for some odd reason. So it wasn't all Phillie fans saying things about him.. so your original jab doesn't even fly. And the only reason anyone even mentioned Tex was jokingly to the Braves fans who were hereDid i come here making fun and bashing the fans. Or did i shoot down ur outrageous claims about ur players and bash back..when i was bashed? Once again get ur facts straight. If he was a Met, philly fans would have a field day. To ur own testament, other fans are making these claims about Howard, which should say...he's not as good as u think he is.
There's nothing simple about the way you put it. And, yes, you did bash the fans when you come here and say they were pretty much stupid months ago for praising Howard, and then come back when Howard is at his worst to try to prove your point.Keyword....MONTHS ago. Did i really bash the fans for no reason? Or was it because i was called an idiot, moron, etc? MOST of you just dont see things for what they are.. Howard is a power hitter, who is NOT going to bat anywhere near .280 and is also going to create alot of outs..striking out. My point is howard is a guy who is NOT a guy who'll bat .280 or better and strike out any less than 180 times a year. Am i really off that mark? or are u upset because im pointing out the obvious and you u dont like it?
First of all, this is still MAY. Do you honestly think Howard is still gonna be hitting .180-something come September?? This is still way early in the season. Do you realize if Howard has just one 4-for-4 game, his average will jump up about 21 points. And if he were to go 10-for his next-20.. which is averaging a 2-for-4 game five games in a row, his avg. would jump up 36 points to be at .224. When averages can change that much in a short period of time, you know there's still plenty of time left to get it better.Yes it's still May, but it is now the 17th of May. Did you just read what you typed? Howard will have to bat .500 ball, to raise his average significantly. Now i dont know of any player besides Ted Williams..who has gone a whole season batting over .400 and ur talking about him playing .500 ball. With hot streaks, come slumps.. he could get, but how hot do you think he'll get. Better yet what do you think he'll bat this year?
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Reputation:89
Level:All-Star
Since:Nov 22, 2006
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Like I said before, Teixeira, for all of his "putting the ball in play" as you testify to, has that gotten him a ton of RBIs or better stats at all? No. Howard still has more of every power stat than Tex, so that's a pretty moot point. Even with 50+ points less on his average, he is getting better stats.Exactly what's ur point? that the guy batting lower is better because his stats are similiar? Well i say if Tex batted what he did, he'd have less runs scored and his team's record would probably be affected by it. Just stop the comparisons because ur looking ignorant. Because no one would ever want a guy batting .188 with decent homerun numbers. Yes i said Decent, because he's no where near the league lead.
WOW.. really??? Stop the presses!!! Show me one person who didn't believe Howard was a power hitter who strikes out.. I'd like to meet him! And while you're at it, show me anyone who is considered a "power hitter" who doesn't have a tendency to strike out. By the way.. here comes a stat for you.. who has the best record in the major leagues right now? That would be the Arizona Diamondbacks.. do you realize they have the 3rd most strikeouts in the majors? About 30 more K's as a team than the Phils, with the Phils having an extra game played. Harp on Howard's K's all you want, but he's one man on the Phils.. the D-backs have 3 of the 9 guys (and 2 of the top 4) who strike out the most all on one team.. and yet it hasn't hurt them in having the best record. The Phils may have the top guy, but their next 2 guys are in the 28th and 98th spots on the | |
