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Big East fans.............


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Big East fans.............
-
Reputation:99
Level:Superstar
Since:Jan 20, 2007

March 24, 2008 1:50 am

You keep trying to say Villanova was 9-9 in the Big East and so Im assuming your trying to say that it shows how tough the league is when they go .500 in league play and yet still make the Sweet 16. But if all the teams who finished ahead of them (GTown, Pitt, ND, Uconn, Marquette) all go out in the first weekend, then whats that saying about your league. The top 3 teams in our league are in the Sweet 16. 3 Middle of the road BE teams are in the Sweet 16. Right now half our bids are left. 3/8ths of yours are, so don't try to argue we have done equally well with 3 teams left because your "Big, Bad" conference got more bids and still did barely anything with them.

None of our conference's losses were as bad as someof yours:

Arizona- Loses a close game to a West Virginia team who has proven to be very good.
USC- loses by 13 to a team featuring the best player in the country.
Oregon- loses to a Mississippi St. team who gave #1 Memphis all it could handle today

Uconn- worst loss of any team from either conference to a San Diego team who wouldn't have made the tourney if they didnt win WCC tournament
Marquette- good loss to one of the PAC-10's best
Pitt- loses to a lower-seeded (even though 4-5 matchups arent a big difference)
Notre Dame- gets blasted by a PAC-10 team who people say can't score by 20 points, not to mention they shut down the Irish's so-called high-power offense to 41 points
Georgetown- A team who is suppose to be the best in the nations "best conference" loses to a school with 1,700 students in its university and who doesn't have anyone close to the size of Roy Hibbert. Basically this is up there with Uconn for the worst loss either conference has had.

I'll listen to the Big East if you put at least 2 teams in the Final 4. Realistically we're gonna lose Stanford and Wazzu in the next round. You'll lose Villanova and maybe Louisville. UCLA is almost a lock and I think West Virginia has a real good shot.

 


Big East fans.............
-
Reputation:69
Level:Pro
Since:Feb 18, 2008

March 24, 2008 2:23 am
Do we have to listen to you if the Pac10 doesn't get two teams in the final four?


Big East fans.............
-
Reputation:69
Level:Pro
Since:Feb 18, 2008

March 24, 2008 3:35 am
Hey wildcatsfan1

I have to believe that A.J. Price would've made up for the final one-point deficit in the San Diego game - as made apparent by the guard play of WKU (though UCONN still shouldn't have lost). Notre Dame was flat out beat by Wazzu, no doubt. Pitt, I agree with you there but Mich St. is right at the top of their conference. And Georgetown slipped up, granted they did it big time. I would have liked Davidson against a number of teams that they might've been playing today. You're also right about Stanford and Marquette, which could’ve gone either way.

But I can't really say that I like much of your argument otherwise:

First, no one is saying the BE is "Big, Bad" with all of it's teams in the tournament. I myself, as well as many others never said that the BE had anyone in the conference as good as UCLA. We said that we had many solid teams and that the 8-bid league proved that the conference was "DEEP". Who's to argue anymore that a .500 in conference 'Nova team wasn't deserving of being the "last team in" the tournament.

Second, WV is good, they're playing very good right now but I’m really not sure if the only reason you are saying that is because they have beaten your AZ Cats.

Third, since when did losing to a loser legitimize the first team’s loss? Would Oregon have faired as well against Memphis as well as Miss St. did? The answer to this question is: nobody knows. Not real credible to me.

Fourth, I guess I totally forgot how important enrollment is for a University’s basketball program. A better argument might have been: Georgetown shouldn't have lost to a team from a one-bid mid-major conference with not nearly as much tradition as GU. I'll give you that it was a bad loss, but what does useless information support.

Fifth, sure we started with 8 teams to your 6 but listen to what you said:

"don't try to argue we have done equally well with 3 teams left because your "Big, Bad" conference got more bids and still did barely anything with them."

3 teams for one conference is, is and I repeat, is "equal" to 3 teams from the other conference. You think that just because our 3 haven't had as consistently good seasons as your 3 that somehow means that the teams aren't equal. They are, right now they are 6 of the top 16 teams in the country. I like your math a lot though, 3 is not equal to 3 and 3/8 is not nearly as good as 1/2.

Sixth, not done yet, you said, "None of our conference's losses were as bad as some of yours". Okay I guess that "some" of our bad losses (two 4's losing to two 5's-2nd round) weren't as bad as "any"(antonym of none) of your losses (6 losing to and 11-1st round). And why wasn't that a bad loss again, oh, because Beasley is the player of the year. A lot of good that did him against the Badgers. None of your losses as bad as any of ours, "ouch". I guess seeds really don't matter then.

Seventh, your wonderful application of the contradictory statement - it has you in a bind my friend. WV is middle of the pack in the BE, but then you say they are "very good", could you pick a side please.

Finally, you say we did "barely anything" with our bids, but we have done exactly the same as you have. I have NEVER stated one conference's superiority over another. I see them both objectively as being the top 2 conferences in basketball; frankly superiority is dumb-it's a game except there's no winner. I dislike all of your subjective arguments when many fans (not all) are willing to use the third person perspective in their arguments. You attacked some who mean little harm and I think you sounded looking for a fight. When subjectivity clouds any persons ability to be open-minded that makes room for ignorance and stupidity. I won't argue

with a person that supports their claim with proof but you had very little of that. Now I’m done because I’m tired and my hands hurt.

I like the Pac10 teams so I’ll wish them and yourself good luck the rest of the tournament. Looks like I’ll need to wish good luck to all of the Big East teams as well since I’m sure I won't be hearing it from you.


Big East fans.............
-
Reputation:87
Level:All-Star
Since:Nov 2, 2006

March 24, 2008 4:18 am
Hey wildcatsfan1

 

I have to believe that A.J. Price would've made up for the final one-point deficit in the San Diego game - as made apparent by the guard play of WKU (though UCONN still shouldn't have lost). Notre Dame was flat out beat by Wazzu, no doubt. Pitt, I agree with you there but Mich St. is right at the top of their conference. And Georgetown slipped up, granted they did it big time. I would have liked Davidson against a number of teams that they might've been playing today. You're also right about Stanford and Marquette, which could’ve gone either way.

I didn't include your entire post due to its length, but I pretty much agree to what you say.

The only BAD loss is the ND spanking and I have no idea why it happened -- didn't get to see the game but obviously shooting under 30% says they couldn't even buy a basket most of the time.  That is not normal for them, BUT we have all known they were no where near as good on the road as at home and we all said it all season.  It was still an expected loss though as they were the lower seed (just not by that much).  So big kudos for WSU winning a game they were supposed win.

As to Pitt losing -- close one to call between #4 and $5 seeds -- it usually is.  What's interesting though is until their run through the BET they were projected a seed of 7 or 8.  NO one expected that big of a jump and a #4 seed.   They were still the #7 team in the BE regardless of the tourney -- that just gave them the auto bid (and they always play lights out at MSG every year -- fact).

The loss for Uconn I agree -- I doubt any team would not be heavily affected by their point guard / best player going down in early in the game and yet they still hung in there for an OT to be needed.   So shame in that regardless who the team was.  And that team had actually beat 2 top 25 teams on their way to getting in the tourney -- so not exactly a slouch no matter what the other poster tries to say.

The G'town game hurt.   But first  of all Davidson is a top 25 team.  They have the longest win streak in the country at like 18 games or something.  And that game was a statistical anomaly.   G'Town shot over 63% for FG and something like 46% for 3s.   Even the records show only one other time in history had a team shot better than that and lost a game in the tourney.   They had more rebounds, more blocks, fairly even on other things like assists steals etc.  The TOs and FTs killed them.  They shot their worse ever for FT only making 8 and had 20 TOs -- this team doesn't usually do that.   And Davidson MADE 18 FTs out of 24 -- more than enough points to wipe out the better shooting that G'town did (they had a mediocre FG% and 3 point %).    That game on paper would NEVER give you the impression they lost.

WVU and Nova are doing great and proving that the middle part of the BE is tough enough to hang with other good and decent teams.   Louisville is wiping out so far but they were supposed win as the higher seed -- but probably not by 18 and 30 points.  The first game actually played against Boise State was pretty interesting that UL held them down so much as they are the 2nd leading team in the nation in offense and FG% shooting.  

So we have a #3 still playing --- #7 still playing, beating a PAC team and highly ranked Duke a #2 seed --- and a #12 seed (#8 in the BE) upsetting a #5, who is the 3rd best in the ACC. 

We lost our # 6 team with a #6 seed to the PAC #2 team -- DUH.   We lose our #5 to a #4 -- should have lost --- and we lose 2 #4s -- one to #5 (mini upset) and one to injuries.   And #2 to an anomaly.    To me the ONLY bad loss was ND.  G'town will  not be explained as to how -- the others were either expected or mini upset by one seed.   

Meanwhile the PAC started with a protected #1 -- guarantee to FF in that bracket (even though they almost blew it).    #3 with great size that almost blew it to a #6.   A #4 who has played only lower level seeds up to now, so should be winning. --- So all 3 should have won and were pretty much given what should have been easy to win games -- yet they are squeaking by.    Then they lose the other 3 -- a #6 solid whoop by a #11 -- who has already been beaten down and out since -- a #9 to a #8 -- expected and a #10 to a #7 -- expected, even though the PAC raved how great the school was and deserved the bid more than lowly #12 Nova because they are so much better. 

I fail to really see how us having one bad expected loss (#5 to #4) is any worse than their #6 to #11 -- and a weird game that should have won based on stats and the game records --

Some people are only willing to twist what they want for the effect they want.    They got 3 teams seeded in the top 4 that are still in -- we got 4 teams seeded in the top 4 and lower but still have 3 teams in.   Whatever -- they can think what they want.


Big East fans.............
-
Reputation:97
Level:Superstar
Since:Mar 20, 2008

March 24, 2008 5:43 am
The Big East represents 1/8th of all of college basketball in the tourney 2 years running and we send half of our whole conference to the dance as well. That says something I think. Also, if Syracuse could have made it, I think they would have had a good showing, most likely upsetting someone since they would have had a low seed. It's no secret that the BE didn't have a stand out #1 team like UNC or UCLA but there is no question that we have a strong conference. Going through a regular season and having to play in-conference games against 8 teams that go to the tourney makes it hard to have the 31-1 records and 28-2's. I 100% believe that the Big East has the strongest conference in NCAA almost every year, but we do not have THE best single teams. Next year we will see the same thing; 8 BE teams in the tourney (again leading the NCAA) and 3 in the Sweet 16. The toughest thing for us to do is figure out which of our 8 teams will make it that far. We have also won 3 national championships in the last 10 years. Yeah, the Big East suuure does suck.

Oh yeah, and the usual toss up for best conference is between the Big East and the ACC; I suppose the PAC-10 makes a happy 3rd when considering the entire conference. When considering single teams, then the PAC-10 is part of the conversation, to be fair. But conferences; Big East or ACC almost every year (and I can't stand the ACC).

Big East fans.............
-
Reputation:77
Level:Pro
Since:Mar 17, 2008

March 24, 2008 5:43 am
I think it was more of a successful year for the big east.

At the beginning of conference play the Big East was looking pretty dismal.  Louisville and UConn both had bad starts.  Pitt lost two of their top players.  No one expected anything out of Notre Dame.  In the end the Big East got eight  teams into  the tournament and I don't think  anyone was expecting that. 

The Pac 10 had it's surprises too but overall I think the Big East played a lot better than we expected when compared to the Pac 10. 

If we look at the two leagues over the past few years, I think I would have to say that the Pac 10 has been the most successful conference in basketball.  Over the past two years  they have had  twelve teams make the tournament, while in the previous three seasons before last year they were only producing three tournament teams a year.   UCLA and Washington State have gone from bottom to top.  Arizona State, Oregon and USC have all built pretty good programs.  I don't think any conference has recruited better than the Pac 10 in recent years.  On the other hand the Powerhouse programs in the Big East in previous years haven't played that well this year.  Syracuse didn't make the tournament, Cincy is no longer a top programs and UConn hasn't been as good as they were in previous years.   I

I guess I'll give the edge to the Pac 10 this year but I expect the Big East to be more powerful next year. 

Big East fans.............
-
Reputation:94
Level:All-Star
Since:Sep 2, 2006

March 24, 2008 10:42 am
Cardsfan,

Sure there are 2 teams from the Big East that you didn